What They Said - Unplugged

As an observer, I have watched PARD keep the issues focused and not personalized. No matter the outcome for a Walmart in Pullman, they have used their rights and liberties and a democratic judicial system with grace.

- "Guest" December 11, 2007, 3:49 pm

I applaud Dr. Lupke and other PARD members for their numerous letters and Op Ed pieces that have addressed issues in a manner consistent with the spirit of civil free speech.

- "Proponent of Civility," December 11, 2007, 8:34 pm

Now we'll look at comments posted on the Daily News website by the PARDners and their supporters since November 27 and see if those bold pronouncements above will bear scrutiny. I have made no effort to provide names, as the posters were too cowardly in most cases to give one. After reading these comments, you tell me what you think my response should be to Chris Lupke's demand that "I call on Mr. Forbes to stop his character assassination of long-standing members of the Pullman community, to apologize for his anti-social behavior, and learn to present his views in positive ways, regardless of what those views are, that would serve to restore dignity to the debate over Pullman’s community issues."

It seems as though Tom Forbes hates everyone who is opposed to the inevitability of a walmart in Pullman - for whatever reason - because he can't talk about them without stereotyping them as elitists. His consistent use of that word always negates his arguments to me. In his letters, he comes across like a big baby and his tantrums are tiresome. I enjoy reading about the different opinions on the subject, but these are your neighbors, Tom - whether they agree with you or not - and it's too short a life to be so mean spirited to people who seem to be trying to do what they think is right, just as you are.

I'm particularly amused by the following statement by Tom: "If you don't agree with PARD's far-left political agenda, then they attack you publicly. Any wonder that the "silent majority" chooses to remain silent". Now THAT's the pot calling the kettle black.

Another Walmart is just plain stupid. But if you have read much of what this clown Forbes has to say, you'll see that stupidity is his calling card.

Tom Forbes has to dig pretty far back into history to find a political battle in Pullman that he claims Wal-Mart won -- which is debatable anyway.

The main reason is that while he has tried to avoid becoming the subject of Forbes' vicious slander attacks on long-standing Pullmanites by not coming out vocally against the Wal-Mart invasion, he has presented hiimself as someone who is not right-wing, not simply in favor of selling out Pullman to corporate elites whom Forbes touts on a daily basis.

And the fact that Sorenson has posted onto Forbes' website, with all its vicious attacks on local residents in Pullman, did not sit well with the voters. So, pay for your recount, Al, and when it is done, please say goodbye to the residents of Pullman.

We all know that Tom Forbes has an unnatural pyschological attachment to Wally World. But what I want to know is this -

When Forbes drives over to the gigantic Wal-Mart Supercenter to spend all day every day shopping there, who the hell is going to fill the other 1038 parking spaces in Wal-Mart's gargantuan parking lot?

Tommy One-Note has an arrogant, elitist, and unnatural psychological need to hear himself drone on, and on, and on ……….

I read Lupke's letter from a few days ago and Forbes needs to look up the word "lash out" in the dictionary -- either that or see a psychiatrist. And it sounds like from what others have said that the latter is likely the best idea. Of course, for a flatheat like him, probably being a hippy would warrant a call that I should "pack up and leave" too.

Forbes' nasty habit of libeling anyone who does not want a Wal-Mart in Pullman makes it impossible for most thoughtful people to express themselves on the issue publicly. Isn't it ironic that the concept of free speech has morphed into free mudslinging as far as Tom Forbes and his cronies are concerned.

Yes, I know what you mean. This Forbes guy is about as nasty as it gets. I've never quite seen anything like him in Pullman. In fact, my display name comes from the fact that people have attacked those critical of Walmart as being "hippies." I'm not sure if this is an insult or not, but I did notice from time to time that Forbes uses this moniker on his hatesite, so it very likely was he who made that attack too.

But what I wanted to say in more detail is that I really do believe Forbes needs a pyschiatrist or something to bring him back to reality and probably some medication as well. He uses words like "lash out" and "attack" all the time. That bellicose rhetoric consistently informs what he has to say.

There's a lot of anger and violence pent up in this Forbes character and I just hope he seeks help soon -- for his own good and for ours too!

The big irony is precisely the "free speech" to which you refer. The whole point of Forbes mudslinging is to intimidate people into silence. And if they are not silent, then the next step is to try to have them run out of town.

Forbes even uses the term "comrades" to refer to people in PARD, as if they are communists. He really is psychotic if he's dredging up this kind of McCarthyistic rhetoric.

Boy, based on the comments above, it looks like PARD may speak for a lot more of Pullman than Forbes wants to admit. As one who has been the brunt of his childish name-calling, I can personally attest to the nasty demeanor of his writing. He even accused my business of engaging in unethical practices because I pointed out the errors in Wal-Mart’s original SEPA application to the City of Pullman and Washington State regulatory agencies.

Matthew Root

You really shouldn't be calling anyone "poor ignorant slobs." It's just not right and it sends a chill through our little community. But that's what Tom Forbes has been doing for years -- anyone who disagrees with him is a ... fill in the blank with your favorite disgusting insult.

I'm a PARD "fringe" person, I'll admit. That is, I went to all the meetings in the beginning when I thought we had a chance of beating Walmart. There were HUNDREDS of people at these meetings. The first one was held at a coffee shop downtown. There was not enough room for everyone. Had to be switched to the high school. The next week we met there, in the gym I think. It was packed. Then we started meeting at a church. The basement was full for weeks. It did taper off after awhile, and I confess that I was one of those who tapered off. I also don't write letters to the paper, because I don't want to be attacked by the likes of this fiend Tom Forbes. But I haven't heard any of my many friends from those initial meetings say they feel any better about Walmart now than they did then. They just feel they don't want to spend their time on this anymore and don't want to suffer the calumny of Forbes. My point: what did Walmart do? Talk to us? Interact with the community? Adjust its plans? Try to work with us or effect a compromise? No. They tried to recruit people around Pullman to serve as attack dogs on the PARD people. And that is exactly what happened. That hardened any sense of compromise I might have once had toward Walmart.

I wanted to remind people of the unfair attacks and mischaracterizations of Tom Forbes and urge people not to use those.

Well, now! I usually stay out of Pullman's business, but this week it looks like you guys have got all the fun! And with all this talk about Tom Forbes, I had to take a peek at his website. Actually, I had seen references to it on Dale's hatesite, so I thought I was prepared.

omg! Does he REALLY put Dale to shame or what? Talk about nastiness. Go no further! If it's bile you need, Forbes has got one stop shopping for you. What Forbes has to say will burn your eyebrows off.

I thought we had it bad in Moscow and was sort of envious of Pullman.

Not no more!

I would like to thank those who have posted into this site defending me against Mr. Tom Forbes’ assaults, both present and past. I am writing a letter of response which I hope the Moscow-Pullman Daily News prints promptly. For now, let me just say that Mr. Forbes has been attacking me and others in PARD for years now. He especially despises the fact that college professors and those employed by Washington State University would have the audacity to speak out against a corporate giant like Wal-Mart. For the record, I am proud to be a college teacher at WSU. It is true, as he says, that I am fluent in Chinese. It was not easy to gain this ability, but I did it through hard work, relying solely on my own funds earned in odd jobs, student loans, scholarships, and teaching assistantships over many, many arduous years. But I am not embarrassed to have gone from someone who knew nothing about China to some who is now a national expert on China and Chinese culture. I’m very proud of it and believe what I do makes a contribution to society, to our community and state, and to America. The US government is doing everything it can to encourage young Americans to learn critical languages like Chinese and Arabic, and it is a shame that someone like Mr. Forbes would try to ridicule me for that as somehow being a member of the “elite,” disconnected from reality. I find it to be very unpatriotic. I also feel that others who live in Pullman and work at WSU have a right to voice their opinions too. WSU is a great university, not an elite, exclusive country club. It is a place filled with hard-working teachers, researchers, students, and administrators. And as a result Pullman is a community made up of many of these good people. We who work or attend WSU should not feel we are second class citizens to people like Mr. Forbes, just because he does not teach there. And we should not have to endure being called “elitist” (and worse) just because we earned our degrees, have risen to the top of our respective fields, and with that expertise and those skills are now in a position to give back to our community and our state. I am proud to be associated with WSU. But even so, in Pullman, a town filled with PhDs, I consider myself an ordinary joe just like everyone else. I don’t have any place of privilege, but by virtue of the US Constitution, I also don’t have to cede my own basic right of expression to others who otherwise would wish to shut me up.

As to Wal-Mart, I will make no excuses for my opposition to it. I have been consistent in my opposition to a massive Wal-Mart Supercenter in Pullman since I first heard about it three years ago. Wal-Mart has a reputation for destroying local businesses and then picking up the pieces by hiring the workers of those failed businesses, often at lower wages and few or no benefits. This proposal will severely hurt Pullman’s whole retail environment and ultimately lead to less choice in the marketplace than shoppers currently have. Mr. Forbes insinuates that I am left wing and maybe even a communist, but what he fails to point out is that I have previously advocated encouraging Costco to build in Pullman. This would make a lot more retail sense to me than Wal-Mart. That being said, many people in the community actually stand to the left of me on this issue, opposing any further big box development at all. This illustrates the fact that actually I am in the mainstream not on the radical left, as Mr. Forbes’ so desperately wishes to paint me.

Mr. Forbes’ tactics are very clear. In the face of very poor same-store sales returns over the past several years running, Wal-Mart is encountering a crisis. Ordinary people such as myself have been waking up the past few years to the fact that Wal-Mart is a disreputable business. We don’t speak for business. We speak as part of the market. What the market is telling Wal-Mart is this: change your ways. Start acting like an ethical company. Listen to what the legion of critics are saying. Look at your business model and realize that ruthless, bottom line tactics where you cheat your employees in the United States, outsource solid manufacturing jobs to the third world where you can easily exploit factory workers, and engage in predatory business practices against small businesses should be rethought. When you do so, we will again spend our money at your stores. Until you do so, we will not.

What Mr. Forbes has done has become the local front for a corporate giant. And the tactics are to avoid talking about how wonderful Wal-Mart is, expounding on all the high-quality items that Wal-Mart sells, bragging about the wonderful jobs that Wal-Mart provides to the community or generous philanthropy that it bestows on our public schools like WSU or Pullman HS, and noting the positive impact that Wal-Mart will have on traffic in its vicinity, the environment, other businesses. Mr. Forbes cannot do that because Wal-Mart does not do those things. Instead, taking a page right out of the Wal-Mart propaganda playbook, Mr. Forbes seeks to destroy the reputations of those who have had the courage to voice their opposition to the Wal-Mart Supercenter proposed for Bishop Place. He attacks the messengers. It’s a pathetic tactic and I call on Mr. Forbes to stop his character assassination of long-standing members of the Pullman community, to apologize for his anti-social behavior, and learn to present his views in positive ways, regardless of what those views are, that would serve to restore dignity to the debate over Pullman’s community issues.

Chris Lupke

He doesn't seem to get it that, agree or disagree, the resistance to Walmart is this community is widespread. When he's attacking people who have vocally opposed Walmart, he's actually attacking a big segment of this population -- a lot of people who have not spoken up so much. Too bad he wasn't at those first meetings that I mentioned above. Had he been, he would have seen it for himself. It's not "elitist." It's grassroots.

I always use this same display name so that people know it's me. I don't want to reveal my real name because Tom Forbes not only attacks people on his nasty excuse for a website but he even pastes in pictures of them if he can find them. And the name calling. It's just shameful . . . and shameless for that matter too.

There are so many people in Pullman just dying to see Forbes shrivel up and blow away.

Forbes doesn't take the high road and isn't satisfied just crowing about Wal-Mart's many wonderful attributes for one clear reason -- there is nothing good to say about Wal-Mart. In the absence of good things one can say, turn the attack on people in the community and slander them. Maybe that will get you some headway.

Forbes' tactics are about as high quality as the crap they peddle at Wal-Mart.

More comments from Forbes in the pigsty (you said it, not me) showing how nasty and gratuitous he is. Why not put forth something positive for a change and stop the defamation? Oh, I forgot, he's advocating Wal-Mart. Nothing good to say.

I'm very impressed with the way Lupke has dealt with this. It's clear he's careful with his words. And you can see that he's basically silenced Forbes on the character issue.

I'm not going to use the term "pig" to describe Forbes because that would be to stoop to his level.

His plan is clear and I don't think he's made a secret of it. He has created a big rhetorical pigsty of name calling, defamation, character assassination, half-truths, mischaracterizations, out-of-context quotations, un-confirmed quotations, and outright lies. He has done this to hopefully drag the PARD people like Lupke into the mud with him. The motivation is what he does not admit -- that this is the only way Walmart can gain in the arena of public opinion.

I have to admit, I'm surprised that Lupke put up with this onslaught so long. But when he finally decided to take on Forbes directly, he really delivered a knock out punch . . . right back into the pigslop. That's what I mean when I say I was impressed with the way Lupke dealt with it.

Here's a question everybody will want to see Tom Forbes answer on his flogsite:

Doesn't Schweitzer Engineering, where I've been told Tom Forbes works, have a health plan that pays the majority of drug prescription costs? And wouldn't then these prescription costs be the same (and rather reasonable) at ALL pharmacies in Pullman? And, finally, how does that prescription plan compare to the one that is offered to employees of Walmart? Do Walmart employees get as good of a break as Tom Forbes does?

It's funny. It suddenly occurred to me why Tom Forbes attacks people with his personal insults and lies so much.

When you try to argue the merits of Walmart, you quickly learn your screwed.

Yes, another good Tom Forbes-ism. Now apparently I smoke pot all day. I'll have to remember that one. What crystaline logic you do apply.

This place is peaceful, in spite of the mudslinging from people like Forbes. It will go to hell in a hand basket if it becomes a big sprawl and/or a mini-Spokane. They can keep their crime, drugs and sprawl as far as I'm concerned.

Nobody believes the lame lies about working poor in Pullman. It's just another one of Forbes'/Wal-Mart's ploys. We've seen all these before.

So, spare us your lies about the working poor, Forbes/Wal-Mart, because we know you're here to suck the last drop of blood out of the veins of the working poor.

I don't see why Forbes doesn't drive people around. Doesn't he work for Schweitzer? Doesn't he have an excellent health plan through Schweitzer? What is the health plan at Schweitzer anyway? Forbes can probably afford to drive all these people around. Forbes could drive Walmart workers to the emergency room when they need health care, since most don't get it through Walmart. And he could put their health care bills on his credit card. That would be better than making the tax payer pay for their bills. Are tax burden is already heavy enough as it is.

The pro-Wal-mart crowd sure do raise some compelling arguments. Denial, ad hominem, and a claim that all faculty should apparently work 18 hours a day, leaving no time to get involved in community matters. It is sad that you think that people who work in Liberal Arts departments such as Foreign Languages and Speech and Hearing are so unworthy. Hmmmm, that logic would mean that the TF crowd does not have enough work to keep them busy. I guess everyone should just be quiet and get back to their own jobs. I sure hope the commentors above are not logging on during work -- I guess all you all must work the night shift or are self-employed.

I met Dr. Lupke once and asked him about Walmart. I don't think he opposes the existing Walmart just the new one. Forbes argument doesn't make sense to me. But why is he so wired over this? Is he being paid by Walmart?

Just follow the nasty, offensive posts and you'll find forbes! Again, it is amazing to me that this is the issue that he has decided to waste his time on! I'm sure his children will be proud one day as they look back and say, "If it wasn't for Dad I wouldn't have the opportunity to buy all this cheap crap and to work at this minimum wage job with no benefits!"

At least Mrs. Forbes had the guts to use her real name which Tom Forbes never does. I won't use my name either. Do you know why that is Mrs. Forbes, so proud of your wonderful husband and the community service he provides to Pullman? Because I don't want my face pasted on your husband's disgusting website with all sorts of lies and insults. I think he said himself not long ago that he sees his community service as pulling others into the pigstye with him. Nobody knows whether your husband is paid by Walmart or not but considering the pack of lies he spews on his website I guess with your blessing there is no reason to believe you. Yes, have you no shame is a question that many have for him. Glad to hear you are proud of that and you've programmed your kids to be too.

There are many "innocent" people in this debate, Mrs. Forbes - people who haven't attacked others, who have simply expressed their opinion on a matter that means something to them and will have a big impact on their community. Where is your compassion for those of us who have been attacked by your husband and his vile, name-calling and hypocrital writings? Or does the same law not apply to you because you believe your opinion and your husband's opinion is THE only one worth considering? I don't mind that Tom has a different opinion than mine on this issue - but he does nothing to bring the community together on this issue and therefore, all of his 'efforts' are meaningless, except, perhaps, to stroke his own ego. I would never be so crass and mean to a fellow neighbor just because I felt I had the right answer to something that affects everyone in my community. But your husband seems to revel and wallow in it. If I lived with someone like that, I would be ashamed - not of his position on the matter - but of his tactics towards my neighbors - people I didn't even know. I agree with you on this: no one's children should be brought into this discussion unless they too have participated in the discussion and expressed an opinion on the matter. Everyone knows there's going to be a walmart in Pullman - and Tom Forbes will have had no effect on that fact. Wal mart will do what they're going to do - with or without Tom Forbes - or with or without the residents of Pullman. Tom's just there to stand behind the multi-billion dollar company and stick out his tongue at his neighbors, like a 2-year-old baby.

I have been observing his fakery for quite some time myself. I don't think he would psychologically be able to restrain himself from writing in.

To Susan Forbes:

I have three sets of questions for you that I would like you to answer, not other people, if you and the others in this thread would be gracious enough to indulge.

1. On your husband’s website out there for all the world and God to see he once wrote that he would like to see the members of the Pullman Alliance for Responsible Development run out of town. How do you think your children would feel if the father of a friend of theirs had publicly called for her or his parents to be run out of town? Do you think that was right? Do you think someone who said something like that has shame?

2. Your husband and his small coterie have often attacked PARD people as mainly being faculty in the College of Liberal Arts at Washington State University and that therefore they have no real conception of the world and, apparently, no right to assert their opinions in the public arena. I am told you too work in the College of Liberal Arts at Washington State University. How does it make you feel that your husband and his small coterie frequently degrade employees in this division at WSU? Do they not have a right and if not then do you have a right to make such a sanctimonious statement as that presented above? Is that not hypocritical?

3. The issue of Walmart and Pullman has been portrayed by your husband as one of members of the university community against locals. Were you and your husband born in Pullman? Have you lived here your whole lives? Are you a local or a member of the university community, the College of Liberal Arts in particularly, and if so, then why is it legitimate for you to speak up and not others who are no different from you except in the opinions they espouse?

I know what it’s like to be called names. That’s how I got this display name. I guess someone thought they were insulting me by calling me a hippy. I sort of like it. It brings me back to the Berkeley days of my youth. But he or another later accused me of taking bong hits, which I don’t do. That points to the notion that I don’t like people making unfavorable insinuations about my personal life that such people have no way of knowing. That’s call lying and its called character assassination. And that is the pigsty in which your husband resides.

It’s true. I haven’t lived in Pullman all my life, but I think I’ve lived here a lot longer than Tom Forbes if I’m not mistaken. But my kids were born here and they are bona fide locals. I would like to think that their parents could remain here with them to raise them lest Tom Forbes’s command that I be run out of town actually become a reality. As a mother, would you not agree, Mrs. Forbes?

Susan-- so you read these comments. Do you read your husband's blog? I read it for the second time a couple of days ago. The constant ad-hominem attacks against me are probably libelous. There are some ten or so posts just about me, mostly attempting to defame my character. Are you proud of that?

Are you proud of the fact that your husband spends time with Photoshop making collages of me, with my picture? Personally, I find it creepy. I've worked on political issues the whole time I've been here on the Palouse (close to 20 years) and aside from the midst of the roadless hearings, where much more was at stake than a Wal-mart, I've never seen anything like it. I know that it wasn't the way that I was raised, and if it's a model for your kids, I find that pretty sad.

I'm a big boy. But when I read constant, inciteful comments against my person, with little or no substance, I wonder about the consequences. You might think about how you might feel if one of Tom's followers commits an act of violence against myself or my family. Regardless of your intent, that's what that kind of constant ad-hominem attack leads to.

Chuck Pezeshki

Students don't rank in this town and you're partly to blame for that. But if you're actually one of the businesses that Forbes claims to represent, you'll take my money won't you.

You also assume that because I said Forbes' name I was referring to the posts. I already said I wasn't. I seriously doubt none of these are his posts, but it doesn't matter to me. I'm mainly referring to what he's already said in the paper and on his nasty website. You should admit that I clarified that. You don't.

What do I call what happened to Mrs. Forbes? What are you talking about? What happened to Mrs. Forbes? Did something happen while I was away from my computer? What I see is a wife who wants to defend her husband or some mere mention of her kids, not by me. Look at the guy's website. It's the worst piece of nasty crap imaginable. And he maligns good people in Pullman. If you can't admit that, then you have no credibility at all. And we're done talking.

So, yeah, since she posted in all high and mightly, holier than thou, but completely hypocritically, she's got alot of explaining to do. Alot of explaining to do. And because she isn't, it shows she can't. There is no good excuse for Tom Forbes except the one he's already given -- pigstye.

First, your husband is not a nice guy, he is a bit of a beast. In a letter to the editor last year he referred to Dr. Lupke as a communist, making a joke about his job as a Chinese teacher. That is below the belt. So don't cry for him, just ask him to be more civil and maybe civility will follow him.

Second, you note that he is spending a lot of time on this issue and that you are proud of him for standing up for his principles. Fine. Let's rephrase my comment: What principles is your husband standing up for other than the principle that people can buy cheap crap and other people can have minimum wage jobs? I don't see it. This is just a stupid issue to stand behind and not one that justifies the kind of angry rhetoric that your husband and most of the other folks above continue to dish out.

Mr. Forbes' defensiveness is interesting given the extent he has drug others through the mud the past couple of years. He has not hesitated to name individuals, comment on their character, call them scumbags, communists and elitists. His blog is offensive, a poor representation of the Pullman community, and an embarrassment. There are a handful of people who post on his site and they are not the voice of Pullman. If you haven't read through his writing, I'd encourage you to do so. He is not a simple libertarian with a bone against PARD.

When I read Tom Forbes' hateful letters, I feel sorry for him. People who act like he does usually have some hole in their life that they're trying to fill. I'm sure that he acts like he does because it makes him feel important and gives him attention he would otherwise not be given if he were to present his opinions on the Wal-Mart subject without all of the tantrum/name calling/in-your-face tactics of his. I would rather listen to the pro-Wal-Mart side of the story from someone who presented their opinions without having to put down their neighbors, just because they have a different opinion. But, Tom seems to really enjoy putting other people down and in today's culture, some people think that's funny. It's sad.

I'm surprised it took someone from PARD so long to respond to Forbes' unfair, ruthless, uncivil, immature attacks. As an observer, I have watched PARD keep the issues focused and not personalized. No matter the outcome for a Walmart in Pullman, they have used their rights and liberties and a democratic judicial system with grace.

It's funny that anyone would think that WalMart needed support when they push their way into towns. They don't need defending. It's the equivalent of rooting for a team when the outcome of the game is fixed. Why would someone do that, if not for their own attention? If someone wants a WalMart in their town, they should say so, but to fly to Arkansas to armor oneself with corporate propaganda - that's a little self-serving, in my opinion.

I do not use my name in my postings, however, because Tom Forbes has previously attacked me with labels and names, rather than addressing the real issues at hand, and I'm tired of it, so like a lot of others, I choose to be a coward in that I don't post my name. I certainly hope no one claims to speak for the community, as no one has been appointed by "the community" to do so. After all, what would they say..."some people want walmart and others don't?" I like to read actual 'facts' from both sides of the issue and am not afraid of changing my opinion if enough compelling evidence or a well-made, correct argument convinces me otherwise. I don't like watching my community be hammered with name calling, labels, and assumptions based on their opinion of the world's largest retailer. Who would be my real hero be in this matter? Someone who came along to bring the community together - to see what we have in common on this issue - to see what we can do to keep this an affordable community that also offers places that we really want to shop - even when we don't have as much money as others. My friends and I even have differing opinions on this matter, but it doesn't mean that we sit around calling each other names, making assumptions on each other's education or morality levels, or crossing people off our x-mas card lists because of it. Even Tom Forbes could earn my respect if he genuinely made such concessions to the people in his community that he's alienated. Unfortunately, I don't think that he has the skill, nor the respect, to do so. It will have to come from someone more thoughtful than he. Perhaps the pro walmart side needs another "spokesperson?" and everyone who has an opinion on the matter can wipe their hatred clean and try to consider the "other side's" position?

As one who has also been subjected to the vitriolic libel of Mr. Forbes, and chosen not to sink to his level of public discourse, I applaud Dr. Lupke and other PARD members for their numerous letters and Op Ed pieces that have addressed issues in a manner consistent with the spirit of civil free speech. A public rebuke of Forbes is long overdue. With that accomplished (thank you Chris), let's get back to the issues of responsible community and regional development. It's a big job for creative, knowledgeable people who are willing to step forth and debate the solutions we need to find. I sincerely hope it can be done with a reduction in rancour and a committment to positive, productive dialog.

Gee, Ms Torkelson, I'm so sorry your feelings have been hurt. At least no one has libeled your character -- which seems to be the operational mode of the Forbicites. Just think how much more constructive the past three years would have been if the Wal-Mart supporters had forsworn personal attack, stuck to the issues alone, and contributed to the effort to reduce the negative impacts of a supercenter on Bishop Blvd. Maybe by now there would have been solutions that everyone could live with.

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